[Info-vax] OT: Rob Short: Operating System Evolution

[Richard B. Gilbert]

Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 04-01-2010 08:06, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
>> In article<keqdnQhK2NVppNzWnZ2dnUVZ_oednZ2d at giganews.com>, "Richard B. 
>> Gilbert"<rgilbert88 at comcast.net>  writes:
>>> John Wallace wrote:
>>>> On Jan 2, 1:16 am, "Richard B. Gilbert"<rgilber... at comcast.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
>>>>>> In article<NN2dnTzv5dZFCKPWnZ2dnUVZ_jedn... at giganews.com>, 
>>>>>> "Richard B. Gilbert"<rgilber... at comcast.net>  writes:
>>>>>>> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
>>>>>>>> In article<THs%m.3839$Gf3.3... at newsfe22.iad>, "John 
>>>>>>>> Vottero"<JVott... at mvpsi.com>  writes:
>>>>>>>>> <VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG>  wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:00A96DAF.7B635EAD at SendSpamHere.ORG...
>>>>>>>>>> In article<CR6%m.10040$0U1.5... at newsfe16.iad>, "John Vottero"
>>>>>>>>>> <JVott... at mvpsi.com>  writes:
>>>>>>>>>>> "Michael Kraemer"<M.Krae... at gsi.de>  wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>> news:hhcfhb$6hu$00$1 at news.t-online.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>> Arne Vajhøj schrieb:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> MS is just another company trying to make as much money as 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> possible.
>>>>>>>>>>>> There are ethical and unethical ways to make money.
>>>>>>>>>>>> It is (almost) always M$ that forces proprietary
>>>>>>>>>>>> formats.
>>>>>>>>>>> Are you suggesting that is is unethical to create proprietary 
>>>>>>>>>>> systems?
>>>>>>>>>>> Doesn't that make OpenVMS unethical?
>>>>>>>>>> If that's its definition, then WEENDOZE is very much unethical.
>>>>>>>>>> I still fail to understand how people mistake ubiquity with 
>>>>>>>>>> openness.
>>>>>>>>> I agree!  Windows and OpenVMS are both proprietary operating 
>>>>>>>>> systems which
>>>>>>>>> is one of the attributes that makes them GOOD!
>>>>>>>> You mean, it's the attribute that makes one of them good.  
>>>>>>>> WEENDOZE can
>>>>>>>> never be considered good; not even poor!  Crap is the proper 
>>>>>>>> adjective
>>>>>>>> to describe WEENDOZE.
>>>>>>> You are living in the past Brian!  W/XP is quite usable and I 
>>>>>>> have been
>>>>>>> using it for several years now.  W/2K wasn't all that bad 
>>>>>>> either.  I ran
>>>>>>> Windows 2.x so I know what "bad" *IS*!!
>>>>>> Even the newest version -- WEENDOZE 7 Deadly Sins -- looks cheese 
>>>>>> on the
>>>>>> few I've checked out at the Staples, Best Buys, etc.  You'd think 
>>>>>> that a
>>>>>> company with all that money could and would hire at least one 
>>>>>> decent art-
>>>>>> ist to make its product not look pale next to Super Mario Brothers.
>>>>> Picky, picky, picky!  I don't use Windows for it's looks.  I use it to
>>>>> read my mail and newsgroups.  Sometimes I even send mail.  Once a 
>>>>> month
>>>>> I print checks to pay my bills.
>>>>>
>>>>> What, for example, is Windows going to do with e-mail that has a
>>>>> photograph as an attachment?  That's right! It will display the 
>>>>> text and
>>>>> the photograph!  What will VMS do with the same message?  It *might*
>>>>> succeed in rendering the text.  The photograph?  Forget it!
>>>>>
>>>>> If I want to do some programming I crank up Reflection 4
>>>>> (VT-100/200/300/400/etc. emulation) and connect to my VAX or Alpha
>>>>> systems.  I have a real VT-510 terminal but I seldom use it for
>>>>> anything; the PC and Reflection is a lot more convenient.
>>>>
>>>> "What is VMS going to do with email that has a picture in it?"
>>>>
>>>> How soon we forget.
>>>>
>>>> My recollection is that DEC invented Compound Document Architecture in
>>>> the mid 1990s. CDA applications supported embedded pictures (and other
>>>> embedded documents, even including multimedia). When properly
>>>> implemented, the documents could be displayed (and edited) as
>>>> graphical documents on a workstation (VMS or DEC UNIX), or in the
>>>> absence of a workstation there would be some fall-back format suitable
>>>> for display (or processing) as simple character-oriented stuff.
>>>>
>>> But it didn't ship with the O/S.  It was an add on at substantial extra
>>> cost.  Windows has the capability natively!
>>
>> WEENDOZE didn't have native email capability -- at least, nothing I ever
>> found.
> 
> Can you get a Windows system without getting Outlook Express installed ?
> 
> Arne

Windows has some options when you install it.  I'm not sure if you can 
exclude mail from the installation; it's not something I ever 
needed/wanted to do.