[Info-vax] DCL's flaws (both scripting and UI)

[David Froble]

johnson.eric at gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 21, 2015 at 6:34:33 AM UTC-5, Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:
> 
>> No, it doesn't! There is no data type like the Python "dict" i Basic!
>> You have to write your own routines using the available (simpler)
>> data types.

Ok, this is perhaps a "perspective" thing.  My impression of Python, and 
some other products, is that they SEEM very versatile because of all the 
library procedures included in the distribution.  Now, to me, a library 
procedure is just that, and can exist in many environments.  I, and this 
is my perspective, perhaps different then that of others, do not 
consider library routines as part of a language.  I've been around 
compiled languages for a long time, and "my perspective" is that the 
code a compiler can generate is the language.

This is probably a rather narrow perspective, as there is usually more 
than one way to skin a cat.

> I think his basic point (no pun intended!) is that the tools are good
> enough for him so therefore they should be good enough for everyone.

Actually, no, that is not the intention.

Specifically, my point is that while some seem (my perspective) to feel 
that some capabilities don't exist in the older compiled languages, the 
capability actually does exist.  Not saying everyone needs to choose 
that path.

> It is true that there isn't a computational problem in the world that eludes
> the power of DEC Basic.

YES!  Just that.  However, you may have a problem convincing some of 
that statement.

> But that's true for pretty much any programming
> language. I don't think anyone here is saving that they have a problem that
> DEC Basic can't solve. I think most of us would simply find it onerous given
> the expressive power that is now available... largely for free!
> 
> I would imagine that even Froble could concede that there was a time 
> that he looked forward to new features added to his trusty DEC Basic toolset.
> I would hope that familiarity with that excitement could enable one to understand why others might be drawn to the features of newer languages.

Since I worked with Basic+ on RSTS V4b, yes, you'd be very correct. 
Many things have been added to VAX/DEC Basic.  An example, the RECORD 
construct, which opened up the capability for complex user declared 
variable types.

I'm guessing the few compiler people figured that if they were going to 
implement some feature, why not in all the languages, not just one.

Comments John?