[Info-vax] Programming languages on VMS

Bill Gunshannon bill.gunshannon at gmail.com
Wed Jan 24 16:24:30 EST 2018


On 01/24/2018 04:01 PM, DaveFroble wrote:
> Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>> On 01/24/2018 11:47 AM, DaveFroble wrote:
>>> Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>>>> On 01/24/2018 10:36 AM, DaveFroble wrote:
>>>>> John Reagan wrote:
>>>>>> On Wednesday, January 24, 2018 at 8:49:22 AM UTC-5, Paul Sture wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2018-01-24, Arne Vajhøj <arne at vajhoej.dk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 1/23/2018 3:17 PM, Phillip Helbig (undress to reply) wrote:
>>>>>>>>> In article <p45v88$1u3q$1 at gioia.aioe.org>, 
>>>>>>>>> =?UTF-8?Q?Arne_Vajh=c3=b8j?=
>>>>>>>>> <arne at vajhoej.dk> writes:
>>>>>>>>>> Languages needed for old stuff:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Fortran - HP/VSI, will be ported
>>>>>>>>>> Languages needed for new stuff:
>>>>>>>>> Hey!  One can write new code in Fortran!
>>>>>>>> You can.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But if you look at 1000 new applications how many of them will
>>>>>>>> actually be in Fortran?
>>>>>>> If you look at the scientific and High Performance world, Fortran
>>>>>>> is still in use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is of course lots of existing Fortran 77 code, but Fortran 77
>>>>>>> apparently still has a distinct performance advantage over later
>>>>>>> versions, so it is used for new programs as well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My guess: most likely none, maybe one or two.
>>>>>>> Probably more if you confine your search to the sector which uses
>>>>>>> Fortran already.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>> In 1911, Hollerith's firm was merged with several other producers of
>>>>>>> specialized business equipment to produce CTR, the 
>>>>>>> Computing-Tabulating
>>>>>>> -Recording Company. The "Computing" part referred to weighing 
>>>>>>> scales -
>>>>>>> an interesting example of how language evolves over time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There is a new Fortran frontend for LLVM named 'flang'.
>>>>>> https://github.com/flang-compiler/flang
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> John, you know a bit about languages.  Let me ask a question.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'll preface the question by admitting that I view much of the "new 
>>>>> languages" as some people who just want to "re-invent the wheel".
>>>>>
>>>>> Do the "new languages" actually present more and better capabilities?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Some do, for particular things.  Try writing a mobile app in Fortran.
>>>> But for much of the real work that drives business (like processing
>>>> credit card transactions or computing actuary tables languages like
>>>> COBOL and Fortran are still really the best choice.  The only thing
>>>> driving the move away from them is academia's decision to drive the bus
>>>> off a cliff rather than preparing students for entry into the IT world
>>>> (their actual job!!) by not only not teaching the requisite languages
>>>> but trying to sway students into believing the languages are dead and
>>>> totally unused.
>>>>
>>>> bill
>>>>
>>>
>>> While not very good at performance, compiler wasn't written for 
>>> performance, Basic can do most of that stuff very well, and much more.
>>>
>>> Much the same comparison can be made with your "bus off a cliff" 
>>> comment, when looking at "the professionals" here and their attitude 
>>> toward Basic, right?
>>>
>>
>> Given what it was designed for BASIC was never taken seriously.  Even
>> after ANSIfication it was still not overly practical as most versions
>> were interpreted and not compiled. What data type of none-integer does
>> BASIC support that can do calculations with decimals without the
>> cumulative error common to floating point?
>>
>> bill
>>
> 
> When talking about DEC Basic, it's not anything like prior implementations.
> 
> 
> DATA_TYPES
> 
>    DECIMAL
> 
>       The DECIMAL(d,s) data type keyword specifies  packed  decimal  
> data.   A
>       packed  decimal  value  has  a  specified  number  of  digits  (d) 
> and a
>       specified decimal point position (s).
> 
> Is that Ok ?
> 
> 

Already been addressed.  DEC BASIC != BASIC.

bill





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