[Info-vax] Python on VMS

[Dave Froble]

On 1/16/2019 12:01 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 1/16/2019 9:11 AM, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>> On 1/16/19 8:34 AM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>>> On 1/16/2019 7:55 AM, Neil Rieck wrote:
>>>> Comment-1: I have been installing run-time libraries into VAX, Alpha
>>>> and Itanium for 31-years and have never experienced any breakage with
>>>> compiled programs. Many of these systems just continue to run
>>>> forever. Systems requiring a specific version of Python are just one
>>>> careless upgrade away from failure.
>>>
>>> There is nothing unusual in that new code does not run in old
>>> environment - that is standard.
>>>
>>> But most like when old code continue to run in new environments.
>>> Apparently "most" does not include the Python guys.
>>
>> And when I complained about this with PHP everyone who
>> heard it just said "So what, live with it".
>
> So do those that want to use Python 3.x.
>
> But I don't think PHP and Python are comparable in this
> regard.
>
> Certain PHP features are being removed or disabled by default
> for security reasons.
>
> But PHP actually do try to maintain compatibility. I believe
> that was one of the reasons PHP 6 was ditched - they could
> not switch to Unicode without breaking too much.
>
> Python seems willing to change anything they think should
> have been done differently.
>
>>                                            Why would
>> you be surprised that YAEL (yet Another Ego Language)
>> would adopt the same attitude.
>
> Both PHP and Python are extremely successful and
> way beyond the original creator.
>
> Guido van Rossum may have a bit of an ego. I don't
> think Rasmus Lerdorf is that bad.
>
> Disclaimer: I have never actually met them.
>
>>>> Comment-2: Python is "very powerful" with interfaces into almost
>>>> everything including MySQL and MariaDB
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Python_(programming_language)
>>>
>>> That is not unique for Python.
>>
>> True. In more ways than one.
>>
>>>
>>> But Python is let me call it "convenient" or "practical" - if
>>> one needs to get something done then it is usually very easy
>>> in Python.
>>
>> It is not really any easier to do anything in Python than
>> in a real language.  But using a real language just wouldn't
>> be as cool.  The current nature of the industry.
>
> I will assume you by real languages mean traditional
> languages like Fortran, Cobol, C, Pascal etc..
>
> Python is a lot easier than those languages for
> a lot of what Python is used for.
>
> As a mental exercise try thinking about the reaction
> to these two scenarios:
>
> A) VSI declare @ and DCL COM files for deprecated and
>     recommend to use Python as replacement.
>
> B) VSI declare @ and DCL COM files for deprecated and
>     recommend to use Cobol as replacement.

Neither would work, without some serious development.

Does either understand:

DIRECTORY
BACKUP
SHOW

And the rest of the DCL verbs that invoke VMS utilities?

As for Python on top of DCL, well, that already exists, so what's the 
problem?


-- 
David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450
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