[Info-vax] State of the OpenVMS hobbyist program?

[Dave Froble]

On 11/20/2019 8:34 AM, Simon Clubley wrote:
> On 2019-11-20, Phillip Helbig (undress to reply) <helbig at asclothestro.multivax.de> wrote:
>>
>> What is the probability that, as mentioned in the first conference call,
>> VSI will have a hobbyist programme similar to that of HP at the time?
>> When can we expect it to be set up?
>>
>> At the same conference call, it was said that Alpha and x86 would be
>> supported in the same cluster, at least for migration, so presumably
>> there will be Alpha and x86 hobbyist licenses, or one which works for
>> both, though perhaps only for some VSI version of Alpha VMS.
>>
>
> You are coming across as having a bit of an entitlement complex Phillip.

Ya know Simon, that is exactly the same thought that occurred to me when 
I read that.

> You can't assume that whatever hobbyist licence VSI may come up with will
> allow full access to the range of VMS capbilities. Didn't someone say that
> the current VSI student kit doesn't have clustering support ?
>
> You also can't even assume that VSI will finally decide to create a VSI
> hobbyist licence. There is absolutely no obligation on them to do so.

No obligation, but, as I've written in the past, the more eyes on VMS, 
the better for VSI.

> I personally think VSI not creating a hobbyist program will be very
> short term thinking on the part of VSI which will damage them, but that's
> for VSI to decide. I just wish VSI would make up their minds quickly
> so we know whether it's worthwhile to continue maintaining a VMS hobbyist
> setup at home.
>
> VSI will also need to be convinced that any hobbyist program will be used
> within the constraints that VSI state, so anyone suggesting ideas to
> work around the end of the existing hobbyist licences from HPE are just
> damaging the prospect of any future hobbyist program from VSI.

I wasn't suggesting, I was observing reality.

> To rephrase that: you are _not_ entitled to a free or low cost hobbyist
> licence and if such licences are issued, any organisation issuing them
> needs to be convinced they are going to be used within the constraints
> the organisation have laid out. I think it's in the best interests of
> VSI for them to maintain an active hobbyist program, but that's for VSI
> to decide.
>
>> If HPE have just one guy doing the hobbyist licenses, it can't be that
>> much work for VSI to set up.  Maybe someone here from the newsgroup
>> would even volunteer to do it for free.
>>
>
> And why would VSI go for the last bit ? Generating licences will require
> access to certain resources that could be misused so it's something VSI
> will need to keep tight control of, if only from the legal liability
> point of view.

You've mentioned "legality" in the past.  I'm not sure that is an issue. 
  I'm also not sure that it isn't.

Without publishing the agreement with HP, we cannot know what is in it. 
However, VSI has said that they have full rights to anything they 
produce, and, that they have the right to sell, issue, whatever, VMS 
releases produced by VSI.

Now, one might then get into the issue of royalties to third partys. 
I'd observe that if anyone knew just who should get any such royalties, 
then the knowledge about what restrictions on disseminating parts or all 
of VMS would exist, and, there has been speculation that such knowledge 
might not exist.

Even the fact that HP has a hobbyist program indicates that usage of VMS 
can be done without any cost.

It is all so (un)clear ....

-- 
David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef at tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA  15486