[Info-vax] Entitled attitudes, was: Re: vax vms licenses

[Dave Froble]

On 3/15/2021 3:45 PM, MG wrote:
>
> On 25-Feb-2021 22:07, Phillip Helbig (undress to reply) wrote:
>> It might be that we are at the point that any sort of future x86
>> hobbyist program is endangered due to the efforts of a few
>> self-appointed vigilantes.  Do us all a favour and shut up.
>>
>> Imagine that you are a fifth-column agent provocateur and want to
>> destroy a future VSI x86 hobbyist program?  What would be the best
>> tactic?  Right: convince VSI that hobbyists have no moral compass and
>> don't care about agreements they are party to.
>
> Indeed, better behave, else you won't get a treat.
>
> And "fifth-column agent provocateur", what's next... "counter-
> revolutionary"?
>
>
>> Imagine if, because of your efforts, there is NO x86 hobbyist program.
>
> If that's so, if the fate of such a program relies on the group
> obedience and self-policing ability of the potential target group, then
> good riddance to such a program.
>
>
>> That will hurt VMS much more in the long term.  What do you really want?
>> VMS to have a future?  Or a free license for your VAX, and who cares
>> what happens to other architectures and the future of VMS itself?
>
> David Froble asked if there would financial losses incurred, you
> (along with others) declined to answer and implied that there's some
> kind of moral or other (perhaps metaphysical) reason as to why you
> need to comply.
>
>
>> Hey, everyone knows that there will not be a version of VMS for VAX
>> after 7.3.  So, as a VAX-or-bust hobbyist, you don't need to care about
>> the future of VMS.
>
> Maybe I don't, especially after I just read your groveling words.  Do
> you have any dignity, I wonder?
>
>
>> You don't have to repent, you don't have to apologize.  You don't even
>> have to buy a VAX license unless you really want one.  But don't spoil
>> it for the rest of us, OK?
>
> "Repent"...?  I hope that was a joke.
>
>  - MG

It's been interesting.

A bit of fun taunting Phillip and Simon.  But, it's their fault, they 
almost beg me to do so.

But, I'm going to end my participation with a serious question, and then 
will no longer address this topic.

DEC was there at one time, but now is gone, with little recourse for 
their VMS customers.  In one sense, they failed their customers.

Compaq was there at one time, but now is gone, with little recourse for 
their VMS customers.  In one sense they failed their customers.

HP was (sort of) there at one time, but now is out of the VMS business, 
with little recourse for their VMS customers.  For anyone with a VAX, 
according to some, unless they have an existing perpetual license, they 
have no recourse.  In one sense they failed their customers.

See any trend here?

And so now VSI is supporting VMS, and VMS users have some recourse.  But 
I have to now consider, should VSI for whatever reason not be able to 
support their customers, what happens?

I sure don't want it to happen, but their business could fail.  Where 
does that leave current paying support customers of VSI?  Will the past 
repeat itself, or, will VSI do something to allow their customers to 
continue to use VSI versions of VMS if for whatever reason VSI is gone?

Perhaps VSI will issue perpetual license PAKs to all customers who were 
at any time paying for support?  Perhaps to only those on support at the 
time VSI operations cease?  Perhaps devil take the hindmost.

Perhaps current VMS users using VSI versions and paying for support will 
have no recourse.

If I was one of these customers, I might have some hard questions for VSI.

This doesn't even address hobbyist usage after such an event.

Perhaps Simon and Phillip should consider these questions?

-- 
David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef at tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA  15486