[Info-vax] VMS VAX License for personal Microvax 3100 Model 40

[Dave Froble]

On 7/31/2022 8:30 AM, David Goodwin wrote:
> On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 5:53:10 AM UTC+12, Dave Froble wrote:
>> On 7/29/2022 1:42 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
>>> On 2022-07-29, Dave Froble <da... at tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
>>>> On 7/29/2022 8:56 AM, Simon Clubley wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-07-28, David Goodwin <dgso... at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And maybe VSI will some day buy out VMS completely and make historic
>>>>>> releases available in some form rather than letting the few remaining valid
>>>>>> permanent licenses slowly vanish as companies throw them out or
>>>>>> hobbyists (who bought new or had them transferred) die without transferring
>>>>>> them on to someone else.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorting out the rights to the third-party IP within VMS may be a problem
>>>>> if that ever happens.
>>>>>
>>>>> Simon.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There should be no issues.
>>>>
>>>> As stated, VSI has the right and capability to issue a new version of VAX/VMS,
>>>> and then issue licenses (of any type) for the new version.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Read the above again.
>>>
>>> The suggestion above is about VSI buying out VMS completely from HPE.
>>>
>>> In that situation, issues around third-party IP most certainly do come
>>> into play.
>> Possibly. Possibly not. Compaq bought DEC. HP bought Compaq. Were there any
>> third party IP issues there? Perhaps Compaq and HP illegally issued VMS
>> licenses? Fun questions.
>>
>> But VSI does not need to do any "buy-out" in order to issue a VAX/VMS version.
>
> My point there was more for past releases from DEC and, to a lesser extent, Compaq.
>
> There were a lot of version of OpenVMS for VAX and Alpha that can no longer be
> licensed. What if, when I someday finish restoring my VAXstation 2000, I wanted to
> run the version of VMS that originally shipped with it? The hobbyist program allowed
> that but the hobbyist program is no more. How many permanent licenses for that
> version of VMS are even still in existence at this point and are any of those in hobbyst
> hands? And the quantity of layered product licenses for that era of software still in
> existence is surely tiny at this point.
>
> If VSI were to issue a VIS OpenVMS VAX 7.4 then there exists *a* version for VAX
> which is hugely better than the current situation. But it would still be illegal to
> explore the history of OpenVMS. To date all I've ever seen is OpenVMS VAX 5.5 (for
> which I have a condist set that came with my VAXstation 4000/60 but without a
> license due to the transfer issue - that was thrown out by the previous owner AFAIK)
> and Compaq OpenVMS 7.3 (for which I have a  hobbyist CD). I'll never again be
> allowed to use either version or any other version.
>
> Meanwhile I'm free to explore the complete history of Microsoft Windows - second-hand
> boxed copies of that are no trouble to find and there is no license transfer issue preventing
> me from legally playing with it. The history of Windows will be preserved but the history
> of VMS will not.
>

Well, this is a bit hard to comment upon.

I guess different people have different expectations.  I for one would never be 
interested in any but the latest releases.  After all, for the most part, 
nothing is ever removed, so the earlier capabilities would still exist.  Even 
dropping support for say, a MicroVAX 2000, is most likely due  to memory 
requirements or lack of hardware to do qualification testing, not due to code 
being removed.  Just guessing.

Attempting to consider similar things, I wonder if vehicle registration and a 
license would be available for say, a drag behind litter, or such.  Still 
usable, but one might argue the legality, huh?  Got to wonder if there were 
licenses for horses?

Anything before VMS V5 doesn't have the LMF, as far as I know, so no PAKs 
needed.  After that, as mentioned, there is PAKGEN.

As far as I'm concerned, some people take the "legal issue" way too far.  Who is 
going to give a rat's ass if someone is playing with VMS on a MicroVAX 2000? 
Maybe Simon and Arne, but considering the whole planet, they are not even a 
statistic.

Go ahead, play with your history, I sure don't care, and I doubt other than the 
above mentioned pair, and maybe Bill and a few others, will care.

-- 
David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef at tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA  15486