[Info-vax] Character sets

[Johnny Billquist]

On 2022-09-05 15:25, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 9/5/2022 9:02 AM, Simon Clubley wrote:
>> On 2022-09-02, Arne Vajhøj <arne at vajhoej.dk> wrote:
>>> On 9/2/2022 2:15 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
>>>> On 2022-09-02, Johnny Billquist <bqt at softjar.se> wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-09-02 15:16, Simon Clubley wrote:
>>>>>> PS: I do now understand why this was done, but at the same time, 
>>>>>> for any
>>>>>> VMS systems still doing this, it could easily give the impression 
>>>>>> to people
>>>>>> not familiar with VMS of how once again "that VMS system is 
>>>>>> different from
>>>>>> all the other systems we use."
>>>>>
>>>>> I can give you a program for Linux right now, that also expects
>>>>> ISO-646-SE, in case you really insist on thinking that this has 
>>>>> anything
>>>>> to do with VMS.
>>>>
>>>> Any many Linux programmers would even know that such a thing exists,
>>>> let alone have any need to use it ?
>>>>
>>>> You could also do a version of Emacs (for example) that outputs EBCDIC
>>>> codes instead of one of the normal character sets when run on Linux.
>>>> How useful would that be to normal Linux users ? :-)
>>>>
>>>> BTW, it's to do with VMS because VMS is the host OS for the 
>>>> applications
>>>> that still use these 7-bit national character sets today.
>>>
>>> For *some* of them including the one that triggered this sub thread.
>>>
>>> The significance of the example running on VMS is probably small
>>> when the discussion occurs in comp.os.vms.
>>>
>>
>> What other operating systems do you believe are currently hosting
>> applications today that require 7-bit national character sets ?
> 
> There is no special relationship between those 7 bit national
> variants and VMS.
> 
> So I would expect about the same percentage of applications
> using those in the across all OS in the relevant type of applications.
> 
> The relevant type of application must be applications developed
> before early 90's, developed in a non-English speaking but Latin
> alphabet using country, developed on a non-EBCDIC platform.
> 
> VMS, AIX, HP-UX, SunOS, Irix, Ultrix, SCO Unix, original BSD etc..
> 
> Many of the Unix application would be migrated to Linux later, but
> for cost saving reasons the migration was done 1:1. It happens.

Very true. And applications for some of those platforms are definitely 
from the age when ISO-646 was still the thing. And I'm sure some of 
those applications are still around. Probably in the most odd place, 
where you'd never even think of looking.

>> If you include Linux in that list, the next question I will ask is
>> how does that tie up with the fact those character sets were considered
>> obsolete before Linux even existed ?
> 
> You have already been told that such a Linux application exist.

If that was from me, I was merely saying that I can certainly write one 
on a moments notice if he wants to see one.

> Regarding why then maybe the application was originally developed
> on some Unix and later migrated to Linux or maybe the developers just
> continued with old habits..

I would even suggest that "migrate to Linux" is a bit of misleading. For 
most programs it's just a question of recompiling.

And I still know some people who still use ISO-646 in their mails to me.

   Johnny