[Info-vax] Leaving all Google Groups?

[Simon Clubley]

On 2023-12-01, Arne Vajhøj <arne at vajhoej.dk> wrote:
> On 12/1/2023 6:38 AM, Neil Rieck wrote:
>> I joined https://groups.google.com/g/comp.os.vms back in 2006 so
>> 17-years is a pretty good run. But the ongoing SPAM attack that
>> started Oct-1 tells me that this NNTP newsgroup thing has outlived
>> its usefulness.
>
> comp.os.vms usenet group on NNTP servers seems fine.
>

Yes. Neil seems to keep confusing NNTP servers and the Usenet ecosystem
with the Google interface he is clearly using.

> INFO-VAX mail-list is probably going to be fine.
>
> comp.os.vms Google Groups group may be toast.
>
> Which is bad as some people use Google Groups for
> reading and posting - and many people use it for searching
> old posts.
>

I wonder if using a site: filter for https://comp.os.vms.narkive.com/
in your search engine along with what you are looking for would help ?
Presumably the spam would be ignored during a search because it would
not contain any of the keywords you are looking for.

>> 1) I've been flagging at least 200 messages each day as SPAM. I also
>> requested help from Google through the feedback tool (almost every
>> day) but did not receive a single response. This makes me wonder if
>> they have done a risk/reward analysis then decided to let this
>> product die on the vine.
>
> Everybody is saying that Google Groups is running on auto pilot with
> no human at the steering wheel.
>
>> 2) I lodged a complaint via https://support.google.com/ where a
>> non-Google employee suggested I create a new group with the requisite
>> privacy settings. I did that then attempted to create
>> "comp.os.openvms" but it came up as "composopenvms".  Perhaps the
>> lack of dots helps to distinguish the old flavor newsgroup from the
>> new.  This makes me wonder if messages post here are being seen my
>> the traditional news readers. Anyway, you are free to use
>> https://groups.google.com/g/composopenvms if you wish.

NO BLOODY WAY!!!!

This is _entirely_ the wrong approach and would mean everyone would
have to register with Google and use the Google web interface for posting
as messages posted there would not show up in NNTP newsfeeds.

NO BLOODY WAY!!!!

This BTW is an excellent example of people who use the Google interface
to Usenet confusing it with how Usenet itself works.

> >
>> 3) As an alternative, I suggest we all unsubscribe from all Google
>> Groups then continue our conversations on reddit where we will be
>> free to continue our conversation under the OpenVMS sub-reddit. Click
>> here to see what I mean: https://www.reddit.com/r/OpenVMS/ Some
>> people might not know that reddit (the first social media company?)
>> was created in 2005 with the intent of dealing with SPAM. In return
>> for free use, the odd reddit message might contain a advert from one
>> of their corporate adverts, but this is nothing like navigating the
>> SPAM we see at comp.os.vms
>

NO BLOODY WAY!!!!

Once again, no NNTP interface and prone to being permanently banned by
some immature power-hungry control freak just because you didn't use the
currently acceptable phrases this month or some similar nonsense excuse.

Sod that!!!

> I am not sure that I see the point.
>
> Today we have:
>
> c.o.v @ GG --- c.o.v @ few NNTP servers --- I-V maillist
> w few users    w some users                 w few users
>
> and:
> * GG users
> * NNTP server admins
> * maillist gateway admin
> has a problem with the spam from GG.
>
> But I don't see:
>
> c.o.v @ GG --- c.o.v @ few NNTP servers --- I-V maillist
> w no users     w some users                 w few users
>
> X @ GG or Reddit
> w few users
>
> as having any point without a connection.
>
> Arne
>

NNTP is the correct approach. We just need to have Google's interface
to it to be permanently dropped.

Simon.

-- 
Simon Clubley, clubley at remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Walking destinations on a map are further away than they appear.