[Info-vax] 64-bit (was Re: New CEO of VMS Software)

[Mark Berryman]

On 1/11/24 11:17 AM, Simon Clubley wrote:
> On 2024-01-11, Dave Froble <davef at tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
>> On 1/11/2024 8:56 AM, Simon Clubley wrote:
>>> On 2024-01-11, Dave Froble <davef at tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
>>>> On 1/10/2024 8:43 AM, Simon Clubley wrote:
>>>>> On 2024-01-09, Dave Froble <davef at tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As far as I know, totally 64 bit apps can be implemented on VMS.  So, what's the
>>>>>> problem.  The fact that there is also that 32 bit capability hanging around
>>>>>> should not be a detriment, right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Try using RMS in totally 64-bit mode. Unless there's been further
>>>>> development since, not everything in RMS had a 64-bit address option.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> My understanding, which could be totally wrong, is that the major concept of "64
>>>> bit" is about addresses.
>>>>
>>>
>>> And that is exactly what I am talking about. Not everything in RMS had
>>> a 64-bit addressing API the last time I checked.
>>>
>>> Simon.
>>>
>>
>> Then I have to ask, "so what?"=
>>
> 
> You claimed that "totally 64 bit apps can be implemented on VMS".
> I am showing you why that is not the case.
> 
>> If RMS doesn't fit your requirements, then don't use it.
> 
> Everyone uses RMS, even if it hidden from you by the language. The RMS
> references are still in the executable you create however.
> 
>>
>> What does it matter how RMS works internally?
>>
>> Perhaps I'm just the old dog that cannot learn new tricks?
>>
> 
> As above, you claimed that "totally 64 bit apps can be implemented on VMS".
> I am showing you why that is not the case.

Um, if I have a 64-bit app, that would mean I have complete access to 
P0, P1, P2 space.  Now, I choose to put some data structures in P0 
space, does that mean that the app is suddenly no longer "totally 64-bit"?

I've written 64-bit apps.  I've certainly never had to copy data from P2 
space to P0 space because of some limitation.  I've used both 32-bit and 
64-bit item lists and descriptors, including dynamic descriptors.  None 
of the system services or RTL routines I used had any problem accepting 
my parameters.  Where in all of this, in your definition, has my app 
stopped becoming a 64-bit app?

For me, it is ok for the documentation to say that a certain item needs 
to be in P0 space.  I have no problem putting there and I still have a 
64-bit app with full access to 64-bit address space.  Nothing the system 
requires to be in P0 space is dynamic.  It is set it up and forget it 
(at least as far as anything I can remember using).

Mark Berryman