[Info-vax] Request description of UFS for VMS person

[Bill Gunshannon]

In article <85729977-e3b7-478b-ab6f-bc0cf32b9574 at d7g2000prl.googlegroups.com>,
	AEF <spamsink2001 at yahoo.com> writes:
> On Apr 30, 8:46 am, billg... at cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote:
>> In article <36821cb7-714a-4749-9deb-b772eddac... at b6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
>>         AEF <spamsink2... at yahoo.com> writes:
>>
>> > On Apr 29, 7:17 pm, "Bob Eager" <rd... at spamcop.net> wrote:
>> >> On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 12:43:42 UTC, AEF <spamsink2... at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >> > The primary one I can think of is that everything on the volume really
>> >> > *is* a file. Everything in the volume is "transparent". In Unix, at
>> >> > least the ones I have access to I don't know how to dump the super
>> >> > block or inodes. And on one of them I can't even dump a directory!
>>
>> >> > So can you or anyone else tell us more of the advantages? And on the
>> >> > Unix side if there is a way to read the super block and inodes? So
>> >> > much for "everything is a file in Unix".
>>
>> >> Simple.  The whole *disk* is a file. Open it, and you can seek to any
>> >> block on the disk, the read/write it.
>> > Is the entire system a file, too? Just open it up and you can see
>> > everything! :-)
>>
>> WHat do you mean by the entire system?
> 
> It comes out of the box.
> 
>>
>> > Re the disk:
>> > What do I do?
>> > $ cat <name of disk>
>>
>> If you wish and have the needed permissions.
> 
> I can't even cat a directory!

And as a regular user I can't read/modify the passwords on VMS.  Is that
a shortcoming?

> 
>>
>> > $ od <name of disk>
>>
>> If you wish and have the needed permissions.
> 
> Not on my Solaris 10 box.

Don't confuse your inability to do things with shortcomings in
the system.  There are ways to access this information.  Using
the wrong tool isn't a shortcoming in the system, either. I
can't cut an Ibeam with a butterknife but that is neither a
shrotcoming in the Ibeam or the butterknife.

> 
>>
>> > And od can't even read a directory on some systems!
>>
>> That is a special case apparently added at some point.  Probably to
>> protect the user from him/herself once Unix stopped bing the doamin
>> of people who actually knew what they were doing.
>>
>> triangle# disklabel ad0s1
>> # /dev/ad0s1:
>> 8 partitions:
>> #        size   offset    fstype   [fsize bsize bps/cpg]
>>   a: 10240000        0    4.2BSD     2048 16384 28552
>>   b:  4096000 10240000      swap
>>   c: 156296322        0    unused        0     0         # "raw" part, don't edit
>>   d: 10240000 14336000    4.2BSD     2048 16384 28552
>>   e: 10240000 24576000    4.2BSD     2048 16384 28552
>>   f: 121480322 34816000    4.2BSD     2048 16384 28552
>>
>> triangle# cat /dev/ad0s1c|od -c|more
>> 0000000  353   <  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0 002  \0  \0  \0
>> 0000020   \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0 022  \0 002  \0  \0  \0  \0  \0
>> 0000040   \0  \0  \0  \0  \0 026 037   f   j  \0   Q   P 006   S   1 300
>> 0000060  210 360   P   j 020 211 345 350 307  \0 215   f 020 313 374   1
>> 0000100  311 216 301 216 331 216 321 274  \0   | 211 346 277  \0  \a 376
>> 0000120  305 363 245 276 356   } 200 372 200   r   , 266 001 350   g  \0
>> 0000140  271 001  \0 276 252 216 266 001 200   | 004 245   u  \a 343 031
>> 0000160  ......................
> 
> Still waiting for how to find, much less read, a super block or inode.
> Write a uitiliy? Please, I'm not writing no stinkin' utility! :-) I

Then why are we wasting our time?  An OS that doesn't provide capabilities
that only you want is hardly deficient.  My VAX running VSM won't wash and
wax my car.  neither will the Alpha.  And, I'll bet an upgrade to Itanium
still won't.  What a piece of crap VMS is.  Get the picture.  I thought
you were seriously looking for information but you are beginning to look
like another troll.

I'm done.

bill


-- 
Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolves
billg999 at cs.scranton.edu |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
University of Scranton   |
Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>