[Info-vax] Looks like HP has been stepping in the doo-doo again

[Neil Rieck]

On Nov 3, 6:17 pm, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spam... at vaxination.ca> wrote:
> Richard B. Gilbert wrote:
> > A union was/is an organization of manufacturing and/or service workers
> > and is concerned with extorting the maximum pay for the minimum work.
>
> If you take the VMS example, a VMS union wouldn't have made a difference
> since HP, with just a handful of exceptions, fired the whole lot, so it
> wouldn't matter if they went on strike or not.
>
> Now, if VMS engineers were in the same union as the
> coloured-alchool-in-expensive-plastic-cartridge workers, then a strike
> would cripple HP's profits.
>
> Unions tend to be incompatible with such type of worker because tasks
> and capabilities are so different, there is no way to set proper salary
> scales.
>
> When I worked for a bank, it was almost like a union, with different
> salary classes a gazillion levels. A particular job had a salary range
> that you could not exceed. So if the bank wanted to attract a highly
> qualified person, they couldn't because they could only offer a salary
> within the approved rates. And once in the bank, the only way to
> increase your salary was to move from a technical to a managerial job,
> at which point your technical skills are not longer worth much.
>
> There were exceptions, notably in the money trading portions where
> bonuses were de-rigeur to attract and retain highly profitable workers
> who were paid large sums of money relative to how much profit they
> generate. But the rest of the bank was pretty much civil service
> mentality and strick salary limits set to jobs. You could move from the
> bottom to the top of the salary range for your job, but not exceed it.

JF.

I have been a unionized worker for over 30 years. It is a union
primarily of "communications technicians" who didn't know what to do
with computer hardware/software people so the generic phrase
"technician" was applied to us as well. There are eleven pay steps.
Thirty years ago everyone started at step #1 unless they had an
optional (now requisite) college degree which meant you started at
step 3 or 4. Technicians are given "management-union negotiated"
objectives that, when met, allow the employee to move up one pay step
no faster than every 6 months. All jobs have pay-step limits so not
everyone will make it to step 11.

Now you mentioned the phrase "fired the whole lot" which, in most
states and provinces, would be illegal because it would represent "a
breach of contract". They could only break the contract if they also
filed for bankruptcy protection (which means the union would also be
at the table). They could break their contract with individual
employees if they paid a pre-negotiated severance usually based upon
years of service. (same as what they would do with their own
management). If they let the contract run its course then notified the
union that they wouldn't renegotiate a new one, then strike (which
includes picketing at large customer sites) would begin.

Many people in North American hate unions but I can tell you it has
been an equalizing force for us. Before the union, there were a small
number of single-minded hitler-like managers who were allowed to do
what ever they wanted to employees. After the union formed, these
trouble-makers were exited by other more reasonable managers.
Likewise, there were a small number of bad employees which the company
was able to get rid of after going through a documentation process
leading to a labor tribunal (ultimately mediated by the provincial
department-of-labor).

But at the end of the day, upper management negotiates their contracts
with a lawyer and account present. The same thing happens when the
company negotiates with the union. Liberty, Equality, Fraternity

Neil Rieck
Kitchener / Waterloo / Cambridge,
Ontario, Canada.
http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/