[Info-vax] DEC rtvax300

[John Wallace]

On Oct 13, 8:38 am, "David Weatherall" <nos... at nowheren.no.how> wrote:
> John Wallace wrote:
> > On Aug 27, 4:08 pm, bbrown027 <bbrown... at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > Looking for parts (in any condition), data sheet, hardware manual
> > > for this part. Willing to pay for consulting. Thanks in advance.
>
> > First, a sanity check. There were various things sold as rtVAXes. Most
> > of them were rebadged ordinary VAXes sold with different (much
> > cheaper) licencing specifically for use with VAXELN.
>
> > On the other hand, as Mr Moroney rightly points out, the rtVAX300 was
> > a module (as used on the KAV30 and in a few other even less well known
> > places, not all of which were VMEbus boards [1]) which was a single
> > orderable part, and afaik (based on having been UK support for these E
> > +RT things back then, including VAXELN and rtVAX300 and...) there were
> > no field replaceable parts for the rtVAX300 - if it fails, replace the
> > whole module.
>
> > The generic VAXELN docs are in the usual places which VAX/VMS people
> > will know about. VAXELN hides the system-specific stuff, so if your
> > interest is software, you've already got (most of) what you need. The
> > VAXELN Technical Summary, and the Introduction to VAXELN, are
> > excellent places to start. Once you've looked at those and if you want
> > to at least reproduce the existing setup you'll probably be wanting
> > someone familiar with the VAXELN development environment (assuming the
> > existing developers have moved on).
>
> > There is a slight chance I may have the specific rtVAX300 docs (such
> > as they were) squirreled away somewhere (probably on paper), but until
> > I'm sure they will be relevant, I'm not going looking.
>
> > If you are in France or Germany and looking for skills and knowledge
> > rather than parts you may find there are relatively local resources
> > still around. Can't comment on other countries.
>
> > If you want to buy just one or two of these you may find them on the
> > second hand market, or you may be able to find one on a VME board such
> > as the KAV30 (or its German close equivalent) and have fun removing it
> > and re-using it (if it survives).
>
> > You have posted the same query on at least one other forum where a
> > well known search engine finds it. Has that led anywhere yet?
>
> > Depending on what you're trying to achieve, if you ever knew anyone
> > capable of building a simple VAX (16MB RAM, on board LAN, not really
> > much else) from the ground up in an FPGA, now might be a good time
> > to renew that relationship. And now might be a good time to make sure
> > someone's got a decent budget ready.
>
> > On the other hand, if what you want to do is replace the software in
> > due course, either with something compatible or with something rebuilt
> > from the ground up, that's a different kettle of fish. You may well
> > still need a decent budget; there weren't that many VAXeln people
> > around, and frankly the details of VAXeln may not be the trickiest
> > part of such an exercise.
>
> > I've no recollection of seeing anyone write about running VAXeln under
> > SIMH, nor do I recollect any reasons why it wouldn't work, at least as
> > an evaluation or development tool.
>
> > There's also the small administrative matter of licencing for someone
> > to think about if you do decide to stay with VAXELN on hardware other
> > than rtVAX300.
>
> > A good time to have established a budget and a plan and to do this
> > might have been a decade or so ago when VAXELN, the software which
> > runs on the rtVAX300 and various other places, was effectively
> > retired. Or a few years before that, when the rtVAX300 and derivatives
> > had their "last order dates" announced. However, the real world
> > doesn't always work that way.
>
> > More details of why you're interested might help you get a better
> > targeted answer. It might also be helpful to say where you (and your
> > customer?) are, though if this eventually ends up as a software-
> > focused project, much of it may be amenable to working remotely.
>
> > Sorry for inconsistent capitalisation but with VaXelN, as with sUsE, I
> > can never remember what's right.
>
> > [1] Here is one example use of an rtVAX 300 module other than on a
> > KAV30 or similar
> >http://www.recycledgoods.com/products/Honeywell-51401088-100-CNI-HDW-F
> > W-FLASH-W-RTVAX-300-Daughter-Card.html Other industrial automation
> > vendors also had similar products. But it was a long time ago, and
> > there's unlikely to be much evidence on the Interweb.
>
> I have my VAX/ELN application running under SIMH. It normally runs on
> KAV-30, or rather the 'German close equivalent' AMX400VME. We still
> have both in service but are moving the application to Charon. There
> the VAX/ELN part was easy. The challenging bit is access to VME. It's
> working but there are some bottlenecks in our home-built QBUS/VME s/w &
> h/w interface that Stromasys are helping us with.
>
> The SIMH version has no VME Access of course.
>
> Cheers - Dave
>
> --

There are (were?) commercial PCI->VME adapters. I may be
misremembering, but wasn't there even the option to use Charon on QNX
in a Proliant, with a commercial PCI-VME adapter as an option?

So other than time and skill and effort, what would stop something
like that being added to SIMH?

More sensibly, it rather depends on where the value is, and what you
need for the future. Investing in VME-centric designs wouldn't be a
bright idea for most people, but I can imagine cases where it would be
worth looking at.