[Info-vax] Variable declarations, was: Re: improving EDT

[Bill Gunshannon]

On 11/28/16 11:14 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 11/23/2016 11:49 AM, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>> Don't do .Net or J2EE.  Web integration doesn't require it anyway.
>> I have written web programs in COBOL.  I converted a broken PHP
>> program that was used for the Department's High School Programming
>> Contest into COBOL just as a "proof of concept". (Remember the comment
>> earlier about the maintainability, or lack thereof, of PHP. A change
>> in PHP with a new version broke the running script.  The student who
>> wrote it couldn't figure out what it actually did in order to fix it.
>> 2 students and a professor spent days trying to fix it.  I wrote my
>> COBOL version in about a half hour.  I wrote a version is Bourne Shell
>> using awk, which is still running today, in about 15 minutes.
>
> You can write CGI scripts in COBOL.

I know, I did it.

>
> I wrote CGI in Fortran 20 years ago.

You can write CGI in any language.  But fast and dirty is the
mantra and thus we have all these security disasters running
on the web.

>
> But it does not cut it in todays web world.

See comment above.  It is up to the programmers to fix this.
But the big question is "Why doesn't it cut it in todays web world?"
My guess is for the same reason COBOL is seen to be in decline.


>
>> The only place COBOL is dead is academia.  They are already feeling
>> the pinch from tech/trade schools.  I can see a future (not to
>> distant)  where they will start teaching things like COBOL and
>> academia will feel the bite even more.  No one comes out of a trade
>> school with $100,000 in debt and no prospects for a real job.
>
> There has been a lot of talk about the problem of COBOL
> programmers retiring resulting in a shortage.
>
> But it seems like it has not materialized.

Really? I thought I mentioned it here, but maybe it was somewhere
else.  The place in GA I went to do COBOL for a few months just went
thru their fourth attempt to find a replacement.  Not one qualified
applicant.  Is the COBOL going away?  I asked about that because I
have a scheme that would make it possible with minimal impact on the
users.  Their answer: "No, it is not going away.  It will just sit
there and run like it has since I left 4 years ago."  This is
problematic in itself but does show that people are not rushing to
get rid of their COBOL.

>                                             Apparently
> COBOL development is declining at a rate similar to
> number of COBOL programmers.

Not that I have seen.  I can find ads for COBOL Programmers anytime
I look.  I know of at least two major COBOL users who are constantly
advertising and hiring COBOL programmers.  Neither of those applications
are going to be rewritten any time soon.  One investigated that
possibility a number of years ago and the determination was that it
was likely not even possible.

The problem with COBOL is academia, not the language.  Somewhere along
the line it was decided to kill COBOL.  They stopped teaching it and
went so far s to start telling students that even learning it would
ruin their career prospects (Yeah, can you believe that learning
anything in addition to whatever else  you studied could do that!)

If you read a lot of newspaper articles,blogs, etc. you will see that
there is a new trend coming about.  (Actually, it is just the return
in a cycle that has been going on forever) Graduates from Tech/Trade
Schools are starting to find it easier to get jobs than College Grads.
And they are receiving higher starting salaries.  The world outside
academia is beginning to see less value in Degrees and more in Diplomas.
Not a surprise, I got into this business at a time when my not having a
degree was not a minus.  There is a major opportunity here for some
school who wants to create a CIS program that actually meets the needs
of business instead of trying to steer businesses in academia's chosen
direction.  General Dynamics has a contract to maintain the DOD Medical
Information System (Which they probably wrote many tears ago).  It is in
COBOL.  A few years ago they were offering internships to CS students
with the intent of taking students with a basic background and teaching
them COBOL on the job.  Of course these internships frequently lead to a
well paying job on graduation.  I am sure that conversation with some of
the other larger COBOL shops I know of could lead to similar internship
agreements between schools and businesses.  All it takes is a school
that has not been blinded by the light coming from the academic ivory
tower.

Want one last blast?  I have also seen ads lately for people with not
only COBOL but RPGII experience.  How scary is that?

bill