[Info-vax] Where is EISNER:: and who funds it?

[Bill Gunshannon]

On 12/21/21 11:45 AM, Dave Froble wrote:
> On 12/21/2021 8:38 AM, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>> On 12/20/21 11:32 PM, Dave Froble wrote:
>>> On 12/20/2021 8:16 PM, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>>>> On 12/20/21 6:08 PM, Dave Froble wrote:
>>>>> On 12/20/2021 1:00 PM, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>>>>>> On 12/20/21 12:45 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>>>>>>> On 12/20/2021 12:16 PM, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 12/20/21 8:12 AM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 12/20/2021 12:32 AM, Dave Froble wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 12/19/2021 6:48 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 12/19/2021 5:32 PM, VAXman- at SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> In article 
>>>>>>>>>>>> <a6553b0e-2769-49cd-9bf6-5e361524a8dcn at googlegroups.com>,
>>>>>>>>>>>> "alanfe... at gmail.com" <alanfeldman48 at gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sunday, December 19, 2021 at 5:43:26 AM UTC-5, Volker 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Halle wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> EISNER is co-located in a data center of VSI since a 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> couple of years.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Volker.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Do you know what city? Whose data center? Just curious.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, VSI is in Burlington.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Given the size of VSI and the fact that it is 2021 then there 
>>>>>>>>>>> is a
>>>>>>>>>>> pretty big probability that they use external hosting.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> How many external hosting sites offer a DS20?  That's what it 
>>>>>>>>>> was running
>>>>>>>>>> on last I heard.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Probably none.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But a lot of hosting facilities offer rack space where a
>>>>>>>>> DS20 will fit.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you are providing the hardware and the software what exactly 
>>>>>>>> is the
>>>>>>>> advantage
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You get a specialist to handle all the computer room / data center
>>>>>>> work: power incl. UPS, cooling, network connectivity, fire 
>>>>>>> protection,
>>>>>>> access control etc..
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A small company could do all that themselves, but either it would 
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> be done right or it would be way more expensive than paying someone
>>>>>>> that does it for thousands of customers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            of putting your data in someone else's hands?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The risk that the hosting provide would steal data is
>>>>>>> probably not one of the bigger concerns.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's not just the hosting company's employees you need to fear.
>>>>>> I don't understand all the trust people seem willing to place
>>>>>> in the hands of people you really don't know and have no control
>>>>>> over.  Maybe I'm just getting cynical in my old age but I don't
>>>>>> really see a reason to trust strangers whose only real interest
>>>>>> is how much the can get out of my wallet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> bill
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you trust the military to protect the country, or is every home 
>>>>> heavily
>>>>> armed?
>>>>
>>>> I was a part of it for more than 20 years.  I trust the military.  A
>>>> lot more than I trust the politicians running this country.  And, a
>>>> lot of homes are, in fact, heavily armed.  A factor that is starting
>>>> to scare those politicians.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you grow all your own food?
>>>>
>>>> Nope.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you have your own water treatment plant?  If you live in town.
>>>>
>>>> Don't live in town.  have my own well.  When I lived in town
>>>> I bought separate drinking water.  I once had my tap water tested
>>>> by the people who tested my pool water.  It was unfit for use
>>>> in a swimming pool.  I certainly wouldn't drink it.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you trust congress,  uhh, wait, don't go there ..
>>>>
>>>> :-)
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There is economies of scale in many things.  Of all the possible 
>>>>> advantages,
>>>>> I'd rate good internet connection(s) at or near the top of the 
>>>>> list.  Power
>>>>> also.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ok, if you're Sandia Labs, no, you don't outsource.  But for many, 
>>>>> the service
>>>>> would be better, and the cost less.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And I still don't see how you draw that conclusion.  It's really all
>>>> about trusting someone who has done nothing to win that trust.
>>>>
>>>> bill
>>>
>>> Ok, I'm beginning to think you're pulling a "Dave".  Playing devil's 
>>> advocate,
>>> just for the fun of it.
>>
>> No, I seriously believe all this cloud crap is a really bad idea.
>>
>>>
>>> Do you trust the grocery store to sell you edible food?  Why?  What 
>>> have they
>>> done to earn your trust?
>>
>> Apples and oranges, but anyway.
>>
>> They have nothing to gain from poisoning  me.  The cloud providers
>> have a lot to gain by acquiring my data.  And access to my wallet.
>>
>>>
>>> It's the same for many things.  Businesses provide services.  What's so
>>> different about some hosting company?  It's just another business 
>>> service, and
>>> yes, some may be better than others, customer beware, check out your 
>>> service
>>> suppliers, for everything, not just computer system hosting.  It's like
>>> avoiding a grocery which always has rotten produce.
>>>
>>
>> One of the big difference is that in many cases you really don't have
>> an alternative to the grocery store.  If you live in NYC your not going
>> to have a farm to grow your own.   But  in the case of the cloud, you
>> do have an alternative.  And, it is one you can trust.  Unless you don't
>> trust yourself. :-)  I know it is mostly about cost, but just like the
>> constant argument about true cost of TCO I think  more people need to
>> consider the true cost of outsourcing and that includes the risk. Much
>> more today than in the past.
>>
>> bill
> 
> Uhh ... Bill ...
> 
> WE AIN'T TALKING ABOUT "CLOUD" !!!!!!!!!!

Sorry Dave.  When it leaves your control and goes to someone else's
it all looks like cloud to me.

> 
> We're talking about a facility where you can install and run your 
> equipment!

With someone else having complete access to your system and all its
data?

> 
> A facility that provides a service.  Like renting a place with special 
> equipment, capabilities, protections, and such.  Maybe like an apartment 
> building with multiple renters of apartments.  Common services for each 
> renter. It's still your equipment.  It's still your data.

Except that someone other than you has full access to it.

> 
> Go elsewhere if you want to rant about "the cloud".  Not here.
> 

bill