[Info-vax] Microsoft (was: Re: Taking a break - Open Source on OpenVMS Conference Calls Resume)

[seasoned_geek]

On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 5:50:44 PM UTC-5, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> On 2022-07-03 20:29:43 +0000, seasoned_geek said: 
> 
> > I'm serious. 
> 
> What evidence might or will convince you to change your beliefs? While 
> we're being serious.

Actually, Hoff, why are you having such a tough time chewing and swallowing the idea the people working for Microsoft are working on a "Windows Desktop for Linux?"

What are three things Microsoft cannot do today?
1) Push ads to chromebooks
2) Push ads to Linux
3) Push ads to Android based 2:1 like this thing. https://www.amazon.com/RCA-ANDROID-DETACHABLE-KEYBOARD-Metallic/dp/B0784VQ3RR

Microsoft can only fix one because Google has the other two. When Fuchsia replaces Android Google will still own that.

What's the state of play today?

1) As you say:  telemetry data back to Microsoft  -  I say gather identity theft information -- tomato -- tomato  ---- Microsoft tried to get some of this with Visual Studio Code but the outrage caused VSCodium to get created.
2) Microsoft had a keyword advertising entity that went under trying to compete with Google Adwords, just can't find the name right now. It appears now all they have are Bing ads, ads pushed to Windows, and in-app ads with most everything installed from the Microsoft store.
3) Both times I worked on IPOS for Intel (explore this computer marketing load) I had to create both a .deb package and customizable ISO. Top brass at Intel said in the EU it was illegal to bundle OS and hardware so all retailers sold computer with Linux on it, especially true in former Soviet Union countries. Given how many times the full OS was pulled down I have to seriously doubt all of those "online stats" claiming Microsoft desktops dominate the Internet, especially given the plethora of iMbecile phones connecting to Internet with browser. Windows for Phone is a deceased product.
4) Windows 11 kicked all computers that weren't made in the last what? 2 or 3 years to the curb. They will continue to run Windows XP (still quite a few out there), 7, and 10 until they change hands. At that point millions upon millions will get some flavor of Linux because there aren't that many PC refurb shops that have their own registration & activation servers for Windows 7 or XP. A few, sure, I've spoken to one via email. The real killer will be the day McAfee stops virus updates for Windows 7.
5) Windows Central admits they don't use Windows for their desktops much anymore: https://www.windowscentral.com/can-linux-win-desktop-pc
6) Wine has gotten lots better: https://www.winehq.org/
7) Lots of Linux distros like Robolinux and others with Windows 7, 10, XP look and feel along with pre-installed Wine:  https://www.how2shout.com/tools/best-windows-like-linux-distros-interface.html

So, I think we can agree that the number of PCs Windows 11 kissed off so Intel could sell more CPU during a global chip shortage is well into the millions. There's lots of gen4 stuff still out there running every day all the way up to the stuff made 4 years ago. The only way Microsoft is going to earn any money from these is if they happen to use Bing as their search engine. Microsoft can't push ads to that desktop and they don't have that Adwords competitor (unless they resurrected it and it is still so obscure nobody knows about it.)

Releasing software that gathers tomato-tomato information about users tends to cause severe outcry then developers pull that code out before it finds its way into most distros. Can't steal their identity or invade their privacy that way. Bummer dude!

Eventually Google will get some kind of app people like on Linux that it can use to push ads at them . . . besides the Chromium browser most refuse to install. 

With tens of millions of machines that will have Linux on them because there is no other real alternative, that's billions of dollars in potential ad revenue someone with sticky fingers is going to stuff in their pockets.

Most every person of a certain age has at least one or two old applications that require an old MS OS. There is a growing sub-culture for retro computing as well.
http://retrocomputing.org/
https://retrocomputingforum.com/
In particular retro gaming is booming and people are paying more for DOS era add-in sound cards than some cost new back in the day.
https://www.gamesradar.com/how-to-build-a-retro-gaming-pc/

Businesses are in a particular bind when they have stuff with legacy software that must remain as-is due to regulations or whatever. Gee, no DEC user could ever understand that.
Medical devices created during the era had all of the documentation in a certain version of Word Perfect for DOS or Windows for Workgroups, not to mention the dev environment. Some law offices have a lot of stuff in older Word Perfect versions that must remain such.

So, there are trapped customers. There are Linux distros copying your look & feel. Wine isn't the joke it used to be and there are billions of dollars in potential ad revenue for platforms you cannot push to and do not "send telemetry back to Microsoft."

Do you let Google put something out there that will allow them to push ads and gather telemetry or do you spend a bit of time creating Windows Desktop for Linux? This lets you gather telemetry and push ads. If you manage to get a virus called Edge ported and unremovable you can link the Edge browsing data to pushed ads.

Who doesn't want to surf for Depends undergarment coupons for an aging parent then have Depends ads randomly popping up on their desktop while others are looking over their shoulder????

You can have a free version that does only that and a commercial Pro/Ultimate version that includes little hypervisor (since they haven't moved into this century) VMs of Windows for Workgroups, Windows XP, Windows 7, perhaps even Windows 10. Now they aren't using Wine but an actual VMed version of the OS and they are paying MS money for it while MS gathers telemetry from all of those instances.

In the ad revenue and identity theft information gathering world MS is losing. Yes, they can push some ads at someone using Windows 10, if that someone hasn't found the tech sites to turn most of those off. As long as they don't install aps from the Microsoft Store and avoid using Bing, Microsoft doesn't earn any money from them. If the computer is priced under a certain dollar amount Windows 10 was free for OEM to install so MS didn't even get any revenue there.

Windows Phone was the kind of failure other failures pointed at and said "God you're a failure!" All of that identity theft/privacy invasion data is going back to Google and Apple. MS is getting none and cannot push ads to the platform.

There is no compelling reason to move to Windows 11. I have yet to hear of a single "must have" feature. Has anyone heard of anything in Windows 11 that would compel someone running XP or 7 to rush out and buy a new computer?


Will Windows Desktop for Linux also be Windows 12? I don't know.

Could those telling me about it be winding me up? Maybe. When it comes to blowing smoke up my most southerly orifice they've never been able to coordinate a story longer than it takes for me to drink a glass of Chardonnay though and we are talking months here.

The business case for MS to do it is just too (&)(*&)(ing solid.

It isn't just avoiding the breach lawsuits, it's taking that big pile of identity theft privacy invasion data and push ad revenue off the table for themselves.