[Info-vax] OS implementation languages

[Arne Vajhøj]

On 9/11/2023 7:39 PM, plugh wrote:
> On Monday, September 11, 2023 at 4:14:46 PM UTC-7, Arne Vajhøj
> wrote:
>> On 9/11/2023 9:42 AM, plugh wrote:
>>> I'll propose an explanation for PHP's wide-spread use: websites
>>> built using rented infrastructure. While you get a choice of OS,
>>> one usually doesn't get to choose the toolchain for
>>> building/deploying applications. It's quite rare that one can
>>> "easily" deploy an application built using a compiler-based
>>> toolchain. Far easier to upload (ftp> mput src/*) an application
>>> built using a script language-based toolchain.
>> It would probably be problematic in that regard to use languages 
>> that compile to native. You can't build on the web hotel and if you
>> build local then it will be different OS, different OS version, 
>> different C RTL or different something else that prevent it from 
>> running when uploaded.
>> 
>> But it is not a real problem, these kind of languages (static
>> typed compiled to native) are not suited for web applications
>> anyway.
> 
> That's not true. I use a compiled (Rust) backend to respond to
> various HTTP POST requests. There's much more to the web than HTML.
> But you know that.

It is possible to write web applications and web services
in such languages.

But it is like tier 4 in the web world. Mostly special cases.

It is not like such languages are never involved, but they are
typical not providing the web interface. More like:

---web server doing proxy and static content---web application/service 
in some script language---message queue---backend application in 
C++/Java/C#/Python/whatever

>> There are a number of languages being used for web applications.
>> 
>> Several script ones: PHP, Python, Ruby, JavaScript (assuming we do
>> not consider transpiling ES6 or TS as compilation).
> 
> I think you're making my point for me? Those are all examples of the
> FTP MPUT {path} deployment technique; which was what I wrote as a
> reason scripting languages are mostly chosen over compiled; which to
> you seems to mean translation to machine code/byte code before
> execution.That excludes PHP encoders (zend, ion cube...); which
> requires a toolchain build. There's also the PHAR configuration
> tactic; which can be deployed via FTP Sadly, on c.o.v. you're
> omitting Perl. "How the mighty have fallen!"

Script languages fit nicely with the upload model

But it is all script languages not just PHP.

>> Some that are compiled to byte code and therefor with less 
>> dependency on the platform. This include Java and C#.
> 
> Agreed. ibid.
> 
>> PHP still came out on top.
> 
> Agreed. LAMP.
> 
>> 
>> And we can also see many large companies that runs their own data
>> center still picked PHP.
> 
> I can't explain such pathological cases.

But it is quite common.

>>> For reference, consider the Web developer's acronym: LAMP Bemoan
>>> it all you want, but here you are.
>> There are many of those LAMP, LEMP, MEAN, MERN etc.etc..
> 
> Again, making my point for me! Looks like you see the reasons fo
> PHP's raison d'etre

Not much PHP in MEAN and MERN.

:-)

Arne